For Maldonado mistakes are part of learning

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He's got more blah blah blah than Barichello.

people wont be happy till hes gone it seems

Learning how to destroy F1 cars !!!

My God...I can't believe people are so negative...looks like evevrybody prefer the boring Rosberg finishing 6th all the season...or the "amazing" Hulkenberg...




GO TEAM WILLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

TBH, finishing 6th every race is better for the team than to win one race and then didn't score anything in 6 or 8 races.

Either Rosberg or Hulkenberg would trash Maldonado in the same car this season when it comes to points which is what matters the most in F1. You shouldn't be surprised.

I rate all of them 3 high, but Maldonado is by far the less efficient driver from these 3. He needs to improve, otherwise he will be @#$%& people off all the time. Giving people emotions isn't and indicator of being good driver. Good driver is who can score enough points.

I hope and believe that Pastor will improve though. I believe he has the potential.

‘we need to learn from the mistakes’? shouldn’t that read ‘i need to learn from my mistakes’? hmmmmm

At least he says "I made a couple of mistakes, that's it. I will try to do my best as always". He's coming around.

Still... I wonder which "couple of mistakes" he's talking about! Pick and choose.

Well...sorry but for me the exciment that I feel when he is qualyfing or sometimes in a race...i didn't feel it for a long, long time




GO TEAM WILLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"In Silverstone I was very unlucky because I lost the car on the entry of the corner"

This is what gets to me. There's no luck in it mate. You were driving, you went in too hard. Everyone makes mistakes, I can accept that. Alonso and Webber went through the same corner in the same way and Alonso wasn't 'unlucky'. OK, that's fine, he's more experienced.

It's not the crash which really bothers me, it's the attitude. He should have been really annoyed with himself after that but he just calls it bad luck. To me that says he has less chance of putting these problems right. Is he just going to do the same thing again and hope his luck is better? I expect so.

He's not a rookie any more. He's trying hard and maybe the excitement of a fast car has got to him a little. I can accept that as well. I could accept it all if he would change his attitude and apologise to the team for screwing up the season so far.

To me he comes across as a spoilt little boy. Most other drivers would be out by now and certainly not in the car next year but he knows full well that he can do exactly what he likes and get away with it.

There is one common factor in all these 'unlucky' events and that is Pastor Maldonado. He needs to grow up and sort his head out becuase at the moment he's letting the team and the fans down.

Senna has been slow too often but at least he has some humility and admits that is is HIM who has to get it right.

To hear Maldonado admit "mistakes" is a quite a breakthrough tbh and is a sign that he at least recognises something is wrong, which is encouraging.

From what I can tell, Maldonado seems to be very much cut from the Mansell mould: ie, an immunity to pressure due to a massive ego, and an inability to look inwards and admit fault, leading to slow learning, enfuriating silly mistakes coupled with moments of brilliance.

Perhaps Mansell won less titles than he could have had he been more circumspect, but it was the same arrogant attitude that made him so fast and got him in the mix in the first place. Would Maldonado have won in Spain had he not been so singleminded and arrogant? Perhaps not. Lewis Hamilton and
Kevin Pietersen seems to be from the same mould too- enfuriating in the repeated silly mistakes they make leading to rare repentant subdued efforts, but usually competing with confident abandon, feeding off their own brilliance to achieve greater heights than their peers.

All have had poor spells, all have been heavily criticised, all are massive talents and valuble assets to their sport.

I honestly think Maldonado can join them too, given time. He is too fast not to.

Quote:

K1
‘we need to learn from the mistakes’? shouldn’t that read ‘i need to learn from my mistakes’? hmmmmm

I wouldn't read too much into that, that sounds more like dodgy foreign english grammar than a outright refusal to admit responsibility.

Pastor will be cool, he and we will need to be patient though. I can can wait. My non-williams supporter friends have thoroughly enjoyed his escapades this season. For sure we are type of people who watch f1 for overtaking, crashes and tragically - engine blow-ups... god i miss those. For us Pastor has become a bit of legend this year - you just know he's going to have a go if he can. It feels like some of that feisty spirt is missing in elsewhere in the grid.

Lets enjoy the madness while it lasts!

the problem raf with your closing statement is that acceptance of maldonados driving is that somewhere along the line he takes out other drivers who are doing their best to get results as well.

if maldonado throws it into the wall then that’s fine by me...it is his and the teams problem to get sorted but when he endangers others and ruins their races then he should be treated as a menace and dealt with accordingly.

"we need to learn from our mistakes"
i'll be watching the next driver parade to see if pastor waves to the crowds as if he's screwing in an invisible lightbulb.

aristocratic regards tt

Quote:

autosport.com
A planned 'hero's homecoming' Formula 1 street demo for Williams driver Pastor Maldonado in the Venezuelan capital Caracas was cut short on Sunday when he spun and damaged the car on only his second lap.
Maldonado, visiting his home country for the first time since becoming Venezuela's first grand prix winner, was due to complete a 12-lap run on the Fuerte Tiunas military parade ground in front of 20,000 fans and numerous political and military VIPs, with team owner Sir Frank Williams and shareholder Toto Wolff also present.

But Maldonado was caught out by the extremely bumpy surface of the show ground and spun his Williams FW33, damaging its suspension on the roadside kerbing.

The run had been planned as the highlight of a day of national sporting celebration, during which Venezuela's top sportsmen, including Olympic gold-medal winning fencer Ruben Limardo and IndyCar racer EJ Viso, were paraded before the assembled crowd.

However, fellow PDVSA-backed driver Rodolfo Gonzalez saved the situation by performing an eight-lap demonstration run in his GP2 car.

A violent electrical storm shortly after Gonzalez completed his demo ended thoughts of repairing Maldonado's car to resume running.

You can only laugh at that. Really.

Imagine my surprise!

hahaha yes, i too had a laugh when i read the title of the article, ‘maldonado crashes out on second lap’. this time though, no one else was involved....he did it all on his own and that is quite humorous..

Ah wonderful. It is clear that he has learned his lesson. Or is this mistake, yet another part of his hopeless learning curve of a career.

No, it's more bad luck.

"For Maldonado mistakes are part of learning"

He was in Venezuela in order to make one more mistake and learn more.

Name a driver who hasn't taken someone out of a race.
Championships have even been decided this way.

The problem is Pastors done it a few times in quick succession interspersed with some other 'unlucky' incidents. It's all added up to one big wave of negative. And really none of them are highspeed and dangerous.

Surely the most dangerous thing this year was koyboyashi hitting his pit crew at the British GP..?

Bit of perspective required I feel.

I don't really think it's about the danger. It's the consitency and predictability which is starting to get to people.

Crusty compares him to Mansell and while I kind of see the point re. ego, I think Nige has much more talent and didn't make an awful lot of errors that I can recall. I don't remember him ever being called a crasher and while he was aggressive on the track, he was usually on the right side of that fine line.

Pastor needs to find the line first and work out how to keep on the right side of it. I guess we are divided on whether he can do that or not. I dount it myself. I don't think he has the mental capacity from what I have seen.

I find him arrogant which I honestly don't think Nige ever was. Yes, he's self centred and has a huge ego and you could even say a large persecution complex but he was humble when it came to his team usually. But there is a difference for me. Pastor is not a young guy any more and not a rookie. His performance this year is simply not worthy of any F1 drive. Fast or not. Senna the same for different reasons.

What I find depressing is that while they half a season to turn it all around, I think Pastor will be in the car in 2013 even if he continues to trash the car every weekend. I hope he proves me wrong.

I hope the team proves you wrong, and brings in 2 real drivers. But unfortunately, the only thing Pastor does right is provide a means in which his nation can waste millions of euros investing in his career and Williams are currently enjoying the fruits of this... I think that money is just too sweet to let go of for the team. But that's the ONLY thing keeping him in a race seat. He's not competent. Fast, but that's his only redeeming factor in terms of on track, and speed alone is worth nothing as he has so aptly demonstrated so far this season.

In an ideal world Pastor could've raced for a slower team for a couple of years and then come to Williams once he had filled his crash quota.

Then again, in an ideal world he wouldn't be as crashy today after competing for so many years in GP2.

I guess the only answer is that he has to improve. Hypotheticals are useless in the end. If he does better he'll be fine in F1. If he doesn't he'll be out once the money runs out. Simple as that.

I thought his sponsors contract says that we can get rid of him after two seasons , but still get the full sponsorship money for 5 years.??????

Really? I can't imagine that would be the case. Get rid of him for who?

I agree with j-s, he is a season and a half into f1 and been thrust into the limelight due to a much faster car and an invisible team mate. Grosjean has lost probably as much points as Maldonado, it's just he hasn't been upsetting others in the process, his car is more competitive and Raikkonen takes the heat off. IMO Maldonado is a great number 2 for a team rebuilding, the real disappointment has been the number 1 seat. F1 fanatic rates Williams drivers 15th and 16th mid season.

My Mansell comment came from recalling Mansell losing his 1st chance of a win in Monaco by pushing far too hard, and his insistence on winning every practice session leading to his error in Japan which ultimately cost him the championship. What did Piquet call it? A victory over stupidity or something like that. Without analysing the 1985/86/87 seasons too closely, Mansell had the pace to win the championship but he didn't get the points, hence my allusion to Pastor.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012:08:14:08:51:12 by crusty_bread.

I think we can get rid of Maldonado, but we have to have A venezuelan driver in the car... and tbh, compared to the others in GP2. Maldonado looks like Alonso.

Here you can read about maldonado's contract

[www.yallaf1.com]

Williams can dumb him but then they will not receive 46million they will recieve less money

In 1985, Mansell had only one retirement not caused by mechanical failure. This was when he hit the wall in Detroit. In 1986, the same story, one spin in the opening GP and then 3 retirements due to car failure. In 87 he had one retirement due to a crash with Senna in Belgium. Then the Japan incident where he didn't start the race. In terms of the title he was 6th, 2nd and 2nd respectively. Hardly a disaster especially when you consider he was up against Senna, Prost and Piquet who all in the end became triple champs.

That's less retirements due to mistakes in 3 seasons than Maldo has managed in half a year.

No comparison at all in my view.

why anyone would make comparisons between mansell and maldonado is beyond me. they are chalk and cheese. mansell is a true F1 legend.

I can see Crusty's point re their personalities to be honest. Nige, for all he was my all time hero, does have some less than attractive personality traits but this is what maybe made him great. I can see that Pastor has similar traits but the problem is he has not managed to deliver on the track. I don't buy the fact that he is a rookie. He's had loads of GP2 before F1. Look at Perez, Di Resta, Hulk, Koby, Ricciardo, Vergne etc. They have all made relatively few mistakes despite lack of experience.

Quote:

K1
why anyone would make comparisons between mansell and maldonado is beyond me. they are chalk and cheese. mansell is a true F1 legend.

Agreed Red 5 is A Legend.

To call for the sacking of the teams' most talented and lucrative driver is narrow minded.

This isn't a scrappy run caused by desperation after being outpaced and overshadowed by his team mate, nor the signs of a driver who hasn't the talent to keep the car on the road- there are different motives behind it. He is a hot headed newcomer jostling for position in the pecking order, and once he finds his place, he will settle down. He was set a bad example last year by another very talented driver who coincidentally, was also going through a messy patch, but he wasn;t sacked either, and guess what? He is back to being McLaren's bread winner again this year on account of being ultimately, the faster man.

Everyone has poor runs, but lets remember, Pastor beat Alonso in a straight fight at Alonso's home race, a feat very few drivers would have been capable of. Further more, he has shown bags of pace at every track we have gone too. I'm not denying Mansell was a legend, but given a full career I think Maldonado has the talent to be able to carve out his own place in the history books.

Ozzy Osbone, Retirements and Errors are two different things. The records state that Maldonado has only had 2 retirements this year. Read into that what you will.

Quote:

crusty_bread
The records state that Maldonado has only had 2 retirements this year.

And one of them due to car's failure, not due to mistake.

It's a pity that he has hit his lowest point of performance in last few years right now. I would be surprised if things won't change in the future.

Quote:

Anderis

Quote:

crusty_bread
The records state that Maldonado has only had 2 retirements this year.

And one of them due to car's failure, not due to mistake.

It's a pity that he has hit his lowest point of performance in last few years right now. I would be surprised if things won't change in the future.

He retired in Bahrain and Monaco not because of the car failure.

In Bahrain he retired due to puncture.
[www.formula1.com]

It reminds me a bit of Damon Hill in 1995, making costly errors,

lets hope Maldonado can have his Adelaide soon

Quote:

Anderis
In Bahrain he retired due to puncture.
[www.formula1.com]

And how come this is car's failure?

If you crash into the wall and you completely destroy the car, is it car's failure too?

If you put puncture and crash into the wall to the same category, it's not my problem.

Quote:

Anderis
If you put puncture and crash into the wall to the same category, it's not my problem.

Punctures do not happen out of nowhere.

Of course they do! If you pass over debris, for example.

Quote:

Ozzy Osbone
In 1985, Mansell had only one retirement not caused by mechanical failure. This was when he hit the wall in Detroit. In 1986, the same story, one spin in the opening GP and then 3 retirements due to car failure. In 87 he had one retirement due to a crash with Senna in Belgium. Then the Japan incident where he didn't start the race. In terms of the title he was 6th, 2nd and 2nd respectively. Hardly a disaster especially when you consider he was up against Senna, Prost and Piquet who all in the end became triple champs.
That's less retirements due to mistakes in 3 seasons than Maldo has managed in half a year.

No comparison at all in my view.

Well, you are absolutely wrong...read the Frank Williams book (from 1997) and "Williams the bussines of a grand prix" racing and you'll see what the paddock thought about Mansell before 1985 and those book are from different writers (Maurice Hamilton and Alan Henry) or remember what Keke thought about him...and he was driving since 1980...BTW in 1985 he crashed in Rio and he had a contact with Senna in Adelaide, and as you said Detroit




GO TEAM WILLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He went off in Rio but continued the race, his retirement was caused by exhaust failure if I recall.

I'm not sure how stating absolute facts makes me absolutely wrong.

Read those books and you'll see what was the concept that the paddock had about Mansell




GO TEAM WILLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think Maldonado is more like Ayrton because they both drove F1 cars and they both had dark hair.

Sure if maldonado is like ayrton is the same as saying that hamilton isnt black

Quote:

j-s
I think Maldonado is more like Ayrton because they both drove F1 cars and they both had dark hair.

I disagree. He was more like Keke as they both eat cheese.

I'm pretty sure his puncture in bahrain came from contact with Grosjean, I remember them coming into turn 1, and then in turn 3, Maldonado had got in front and BOOM. and well... Who didn't see Maldonado use that HRT as a ramp of sorts in Monaco.

Well Ozzy, comparing them on their taste for cheese is simply ridiculous. Ayrton had a much more sophisticated palate than Pastor, who is known for preferring individually wrapped american cheese over a nice chunk of gruyere.

OK, fair point. But I know for a fact from my inside F1 sources that Alex Yoong liked nothing better than a kilo of stilton of the bluest variety before a race. He said it gave hime 'Cheese Power' whatever that was. Maybe these young guns could learn from a guy like that. You could certainly see the results.

Pastor could start with some mild cheddar on a cracker before moving onto stronger stuff. I wonder if that could be the key to unlocking this 'lack of brain cells' dilema?

ayrton senna ate 500 grams of ‘port salut’ before each race as it gave him ‘cheesus power’ which was consistent with his religious leanings.

What did Mansell eat? A full round of Afterburner soaked in High Octane Leaded Petrol.

i am reliably informed that mansell was known to eat around a kilo of chilis before a race !!!!!!

Quote:

williamsf1FW34
Sure if maldonado is like ayrton is the same as saying that hamilton isnt black

hamilton isnt black, he is mixed race, he is just as much white as he is black.

Quote:

Mansell`s flying wheelnut

Quote:

williamsf1FW34
Sure if maldonado is like ayrton is the same as saying that hamilton isnt black

hamilton isnt black, he is mixed race, he is just as much white as he is black.

So u are saying that maldonado is the next best driver ever?

The only 2 records what maldonado can get is

1 the driver who has paid the most money to a team ever
2 the driver who has made the most chrashes ever

Quote:

williamsf1FW34

Quote:

Mansell`s flying wheelnut

Quote:

williamsf1FW34
Sure if maldonado is like ayrton is the same as saying that hamilton isnt black

hamilton isnt black, he is mixed race, he is just as much white as he is black.

So u are saying that maldonado is the next best driver ever?

The only 2 records what maldonado can get is

1 the driver who has paid the most money to a team ever
2 the driver who has made the most chrashes ever

Go @#$%& yourself.

Quote:

Sumon

Quote:

williamsf1FW34

Quote:

Mansell`s flying wheelnut

Quote:

williamsf1FW34
Sure if maldonado is like ayrton is the same as saying that hamilton isnt black

hamilton isnt black, he is mixed race, he is just as much white as he is black.

So u are saying that maldonado is the next best driver ever?

The only 2 records what maldonado can get is

1 the driver who has paid the most money to a team ever
2 the driver who has made the most chrashes ever

Go @#$%& yourself.

Why does he need to do that? Maybe his wife helps him with that. Don't forget also 3, the driver who will continuously neglect responsibility for his repetitive stupid crashes the longest.

Quote:

Mikef1
Why does he need to do that? Maybe his wife helps him with that. Don't forget also 3, the driver who will continuously neglect responsibility for his repetitive stupid crashes the longest.

Because he is a @#$%& hypocrite. Many times I have seen him defending Bruno by saying this is fans forum, not "drivers bashing forum" or something like that. But he does the opposite of what he says. He is constantly belittling Maldonado and mocks him. I've seen him do that many times, but I used to ignore it. Not anymore though, this was the last straw.

Quote:

Sumon

Quote:

Mikef1
Why does he need to do that? Maybe his wife helps him with that. Don't forget also 3, the driver who will continuously neglect responsibility for his repetitive stupid crashes the longest.

Because he is a @#$%& hypocrite. Many times I have seen him defending Bruno by saying this is fans forum, not "drivers bashing forum" or something like that. But he does the opposite of what he says. He is constantly belittling Maldonado and mocks him. I've seen him do that many times, but I used to ignore it. Not anymore though, this was the last straw.

So you think saying bad names to me will fix maldonado's problems?

at least i use evidence for what im saying most people here are just saying what they can see on tv and tv shows only like 10% of what the info what exist

Also a lot of poeple have the same opioning as the reporter of the race

I dont listen to them and make my own conclusions because most reporters are haters like if someone pays money for a seat he cant drive thats crap

they dont know that alonso is then also a pay driving because his sponsors pay like the same amount of his own salary

Quote:

Sumon

Quote:

Mikef1
Why does he need to do that? Maybe his wife helps him with that. Don't forget also 3, the driver who will continuously neglect responsibility for his repetitive stupid crashes the longest.

Because he is a @#$%& hypocrite. Many times I have seen him defending Bruno by saying this is fans forum, not "drivers bashing forum" or something like that. But he does the opposite of what he says. He is constantly belittling Maldonado and mocks him. I've seen him do that many times, but I used to ignore it. Not anymore though, this was the last straw.

I have to agree with Sumon on that. The problem is not the oppinions and arguments (Everyone is free to agree or not), but the hypocrisy... that is a shame.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012:08:19:19:09:08 by ronald.paloschi.

In trouble again??

A well known williams F1 driver is said to of podged the queue at a large supermarket,
The victim of this maneuver said he went for a gap that was not there.
Store owners are checking the cctv tapes to see how aggressive the maneuver was as we speak. before deciding if to punish him and take away the gentlemans reward points.
Will it never end
Hehe.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2012:08:21:12:09:03 by gpl.

Quote:

K1
i am reliably informed that mansell was known to eat around a kilo of chilis before a race !!!!!!

so that's why he kicked up so much of a stink in the garage. SFW said he was popular in the car, but not out of it. Now we know the real reason!

Quote:

crusty_bread

Quote:

K1
i am reliably informed that mansell was known to eat around a kilo of chilis before a race !!!!!!

so that's why he kicked up so much of a stink in the garage. SFW said he was popular in the car, but not out of it. Now we know the real reason!

On a thread a while back, Pablo reminded me of that famous quote: 'Mansell was loved by everyone who never met him'.

As it happened, Keke got on with Mansell in the end.

What a great driver line-up that was. If only . . .